[Glorantha] Re: Sartarite Cavalry

Donald Oddy
>>And the
>>fact that we didn't write a "Orlanth the Rider" keyword should not be
>>taken to indicate that there *isn't* such a subcult.

> Peter has pointed out Ulanin the rider in GT but even that subcult
> doesn't seem to have been worshipped in all tribes.

There is more to the life as a housecarl than just riding patrol. Quite normally these people will specialize on different aspects of their job in their worship.

Beren the Rider is the main horse warrior cult, but far from every horse warrior needs to be an initiate.

> Except that in Orlanthi mythology Elmal is guardian of the stead who
> remains behind when the warband goes off to fight.

Elmal the Thane, yes. Beren the Rider was a Vingkotling chieftain, and a horse warrior, famous for his raids. (So was Ulanin.)

> Given that most
> Elmali are members of Elmali clans there must be many Sartarite
> clans with no Elmali never mind one to go with the warband as well
> as one to stay at home.

Well, a unit entirely composed of Beren initiates would be expected to excel on Grazer scale, but I doubt such a Sartarite unit exists on Dragon Pass boardgame scale. It becomes different when not the individual cultic initiation but the warband guardian has the horse riding blessings, and IMO that's how mounted warbands operate.

> Ability to ride does not equate to ability to fight from horseback
> never mind acting as cavalry. At best "fight from horseback" would
> be the lowest of "ride" and "fight".

Probably yes, but will depend as strongly on the horse, too. The less effort has to be spent on the horse riding against a foe, the more effort can be put into hitting that foe at high speed.

> And some Orlanthi weapons, such
> as slings, would be very iffy to use from horseback.

>From a moving horse - yes. So expect a mounted Hedkoranthi to slow down,
sling a few thunderstones from useful distance, and then speed up to join up with his non-skirmishing fellows in the band.

>>If the fyrd is going to be called out, the warband is *already* out.
>>If (in WBRM/DP) the proportion of Cavalry to Foot is heavily weighted
>>in favor of Cavalry, and only 40% pof the fyrd is represented, then
>>figure the entire muster of Sartar would be those 6 "Militia Cavalry"
>>units, and 15-16 "Militia foot" units, instead of the 6 and 6 that
>>the counter mix actually gives you.

> It's 8 and 8 in WBRM, although that does include one of each
> which is a Tarsh unit. Perhaps that's one of the changes in
> DP. I wouldn't expect all the fyrds to be available but I'd
> thought it would be higher than 40%.

In case of a greater war, the fyrd is assembled, and volunteers or delegates join the royal warbands while the rest returns to their usual role as emergency force. Talking about the fyrd as in clan fyrd will be misleading.

Instead, we are faced with the city militia (assuming that the royal warbands use the cities as focus for mustering). Lots of volunteer part-time warriors join up with the core of professionals which are present in each unit (as sub-leaders).

>>Well, as is said, YGMV. In *my* Sartar, Heortling warriors are as
>>good on horseback as they are on foot, and quite happy to charge the
>>enemy as a primary function. Maybe they aren't as good as "native
>>horsemen" like the Pol Joni or Char Un or Grazers, that's fine with
>>me; I'm not saying they should be that good. But the counters of WBRM
>>do indicate that they are better than the Tarshite "professional"
>>Cavalry, and on a par with the Lunar Cavalry Corps mid-class units.

> They are better than the Furthest Horse but equal to the Furthest
> Veterans. I see the former as a militia cavalry (TiF shows them as
> part timers). The superiority of the Sartarites in combat and
> movement reflects the commitment of full time warriors in comparison
> to part-time but probably more disciplined troops. Even so I reckon
> in a straight charge the Tarshite lancers would win, it's just that
> the Sartarites would avoid that situtaion. Say luring the Tarshites
> into a charge against part of them while the rest of the warband
> snuck round the flank.

Tarsh probably leaks its professional warriors into imperial units (e.g. Cavalry Corps).

Another important consideration: the Tarshite forces in DP/WB&RM are post-Dragonrise forces, minus the Fazzurites (Cavalry Corps quality troops).

James Holloway

> Can Sartarites even get the Cavalry Soldier occupation keyword? I know
> they can take Warrior, which includes Ride, and I suppose they could
> take a mounted fighting style as their Unit Style Mass Combat, but they'd
> still be short on specifically cavalry magic. In general, the magic of
> Orlanthi fighting cults seems to fit fighting on foot better.

The occupations in "Thunder Rebels" are focussed on clansmen. IMO the "Cavalry Soldier" equivalent in Sartar is an advanced occupation, and implies leaving the clan behind (joining a king's warband, or similar) for considerable time spans. Since the Lunar occupation, only on the tribal level and no longer on city confederation or principality level. Prior to the occupation, the keyword may have been more accessible...

> All of this may contradict WBRM, but I think we may just have to accept
> that the conception of Sartarite society has changed since it was
> published.

Sartarite history still has those cavalry moments in King of Sartar, and the one or two Orlanth battle myths in that book have Orlanth and his followers charging into battle, too.

> Which is not to say that Sartarite warriors don?t fight on horseback - I
> just doubt that they do so in anything that could be interpreted in any
> but the loosest way as a "cavalry regiment."

One of the first implications of the Lunar occupation was to disband all those regimental structures. I suspect that many standards of the city militias are hidden away, along with a barely tended guardian. Received on Thu 21 Sep 2006 - 12:15:24 EEST