[Glorantha]Magic and faith

From: Peter Metcalfe <metcalph_at_quicksilver.net.nz>
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:34:38 +1300


Andrew Lawson:

>Firstly, while belief in the supernatural was common in the Middle Ages, and
>certainly influences the way people understood the world around them, it does
>not mean that belief in the supernatural was universal.

Who in the middle ages didn't believe in the supernatural?

>Secondly, belief in the supernatural is not the same as belief in religion.

Neither is modern faith the same as ancient faith. Pointing out that people believed in the supernatural in the Good Old Days illustrates why arguments based on modern faith are fallacious in proving that Gloranthans are Not Like Us.

>There are enough examples of people changing their
>religious affiliations (becoming members of sects like the Cathars or
>Waldensians or returning to the Church and abandoning heretical sects or
>even waffling between the two) to show that it was a regular, if not common,
>experience.

Gloranthans change their religious affiliations just as frequently as many lunarized Sartarites and Sable Riders will be glad to inform you.

> > I dunno why you consider communion services not to be masses but it is
> > a good example of a RW magical event and an inspiration for Malkioni
> > religious practices. It is the real presence of magic that validates most
> > religious teachings in glorantha, not the otherworld trips that are
> performed
> > by the pious (and the Orlanthi).

>Communion and the Mass are both forms of the Eucharist. Lutheran
>communion/the Lords Supper is derived from the Catholic Mass; the ritual is
>simply understood differently. (I'm speaking as a Lutheran, incidentally.)
>However, again, I would have to agree with Andy here. Communion and the
>Mass do not involve crossing over into another time and space.

I didn't say they were otherworld trips, I said they were magical acts and that
was what validated most religious teachings in glorantha.

>For most Christians, faith in the efficacy of the rituals represents a
>belief that the divine is manifesting itself in the physical world in some
>way. I wouldn't say that it validates Christian teachings, however.

People living in the Middle Ages would disagree with you.

--Peter Metcalfe

--__--__-- Received on Wed 18 Feb 2004 - 06:10:25 EET

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