From: Joerg Baumgartner (joe@toppoint.de)
Date: Sun 29 Jun 1997 - 04:24:00 EEST
V.S. Greene
> There's been mention of one of the three Yelmalios as having
>originally having something to do with a "Sun Dragon" heresy. I'm plotting a
>future campaign set in 4th
>Age Glorantha after most of the gods are dead/absent/distant/gone to the Next
>Level Above Divinity and people turn to other worship forms.
Quite certainly there are dragons left in Glorantha after Argrath's
cataclysms, after all they are instrumental in his schemings. If there are
still people around in Pavis who a) have a need to worship someone and b)
don't see any point in worshipping Pavis, they might turn to the Sun Dragon
but I'm curious what kind of people these should be.
>The talk of the
>Sun Dragon and the Praxian Sun Dome Temple appeals to me; I'm figuring that
>with Yelmalio the god seemingly different the Templars would revert/return to
>an older faith.
I don't think that Yelmalio was part of Argrath's Ritual of the Net, since
this included only the Dead Gods assembled in Hell. Whatever you want to say
about Yelmalio, Hell is a place he hasn't visited.
Do you have a specific reason to eliminate Yelmalio from the array of
surviving deities? There is sort of proof that even some of the deities who
should have participated in the Ritual of the Net did survive, at least I
wonder what god was the patron of the library in New Jonston.
>What was the Sun Dragon cult like?
What was any EWF dragon cult like? From what we know about the EWF, there
was a strong priesthood (inherited from the changes wrought by Lokamayadon
and Harmast) supervising and not rarely superceding the "mundane" kings and
other rulers. These dragon priests began to emulate dragons, then became
dragons - some individually, some as a group, most heavily supported by
their cults backing them, but some like Ingolf mostly on their own.
When Alakoring invaded the EWF from the northwest, the dragon priests
"summoned" Drang the Diamond Storm Dragon against him, and when Alakoring
had the temerity to slay Drang, a lot of priests lost their power.
Since I believe that the core of the EWF magics are about true dreaming, IMO
the great (true? created?) dragons dominant during the heyday of the EWF
were the collective dreams and manifestations of the powerful dragon
"priests" and their cults.
(I cannot provide conclusive sources for my believes, but I have a couple of
clues indicating that the magic which made dreams become reality was part of
the EWF methods: first of all, there is the dragonewt ruler (and Inhuman
King) magical effect to produce a dream dragon. A dream dragon is as real as
any rock or other part of creation you can think of, but it is a draconic
dream made reality. IMO the EWF priesthood did the same thing, but went a
step further, and included part of the reality in their dream manifestations.
Secondary clues might be found in the surviving remnants of the EWF. One of
these is Delecti, who managed to transform a large area of dragon land into
something different (the Upland Marsh). We know that the EWF priesthood
"awakened" (created?) the dragon which left Ormsgone Valley, a gap which
once was part of the Western Rockwood chain. Obviously they used the land to
do so. Lesser manifestations of this ability might still be encountered in
or around Ormsgone Valley, as Genertela Players Book shows on the back cover.
Then there is the Puppeteer troupe, which for some reason frequents the EWF
ruins in Dragon Pass as their favourite staging areas. They are masters of
illusions or dreams made reality, and it takes a True Dragon to tell their
illusionary armies apart from real ones. IMO they are an altered version of
the Waltzing and Hunting Bands initiated by Vistikos Left-eye.
And there is Pavis with its remnants of EWF-related magics, like the Puzzle
Apart from all this, the EWF magicians seem to have adopted or developed
Canal, which IMO is a means to enter the dream realms involved in draconic
magic physically.
some sort of "sorcery", as in "Delecti the Sorcerer", "City of 10,000
Magicians", Iffinbinx or Remakerela (horrible word...). This may have been
similar to Carmanian, Stygian or God Learner Sorcery (which IMO differ in
certain ways) but might as well have resembled "Godunya's Magic" from GoG.)
>Would it be sort of Path of Immanent Mastery-ish, or would it be an
I'd prefer the latter, given the fact that the God Learners never managed to
abstract >sort of mysticism?
comprehend the EWF ideas, whereas they seem to have understood the Immanent
Mastery stuff in their light of their Hsunchen-Hykim construct. As the
history section in Griffin Mountain tells us, the later EWF aka Third
Council changed from a (nominally?) benevolent missionary movement (via the
Hunting and Waltzing Bands) into a power-channeling, dominating system in
order to "make True Dragons" and ultimately "reconstruct the Cosmic Dragon"
- - or in less condemning words, the top level priesthood had become so
draconic in their thinking that they failed to understand the human thinking
of their newly acquisitioned subjects on the fringes.
>What benefits would worshippers gain, if any?
Magical powers associated with the sun - heat, light, perhaps even
sovereignty - and with dragons - a certain immunity to spirits (like with
Obduran the Flyer) and lunar cyclical or other effects (remember the Lunar
Fallout theory? An immunity to lunar-polluted country could offer a
comparatively safe haven during the cataclysms), again fire powers, perhaps
the abilities to hibernate or to sidestep distances (although that's rather
a dragonewt power). And perhaps as much or as little as the friendship of
the dragonewts tending their "shrine" in the Rubble.
>And of course, is the idea of a Sun Dragon Revival absurd?
In the (absence of) light of the cataclysms which Argrath (and others)
produced during the Hero Wars, it seems very likely that the survivors
grouped themselves around any power which promised to preserve them. This
has precedents in Gloranthan history and pre-history - the Ralian humans
turning to the beast ways during the Greater Darkness (after ZZ ravaged
their holy centre at Hrelar Amali), the humans turned into the Cannon Cult
during the Dragonkill War, the Haranding acceptance of the Only Old One as
their ruler into the Silver Age, etc. (Yes, some of these are shaky, so
shoot away...)
If this cult serves a need in your campaign, go and develop it. My musings
above try to describe the 2nd Age (and perhaps still early 3rd Age)
manifestation of the cult in the city of Pavis. Whatever its nature, I think
the cult effectively died out when the trolls under Geras Kag conquered
Pavis, and took the "draconic corner" south of the Garden (around Yelmalio
Hill) into their patrols.
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