From: David Cake (davidc@cyllene.uwa.edu.au)
Date: Tue 01 Jul 1997 - 12:56:53 EEST
Stephen Lucek is that latest of many to argue that the Orlanthi/Lunar
hostility is culturally/religiously inevitable...
>I think the Orlanthi love
>of independence and hatred of chaos would mean they would be completely
>opposed to the Empire.
The Lunar Way has certainly been known to reward independence -
A better approach, rather than theorising about broad religious
many of its greatest saints found their path independently, for example.
And it shouldn't be forgotten that the Lunar path originated in rebellion
(of the Seven Mothers against the Carmanian Emperors, among other things).
You might be thinking of the Dara Happan distrust of independence, and
indeed in some ways the Lunar Empire is a thin veneer of Lunar philosophy
over a Dara Happan foundation. But then again, Dara Happans hate chaos
too...
themes and values, is to look at the historical evidence. As has been
repeated many many times, Tarsh etc. are proof by example that Lunars and
Orlanthi can get along. The Orlanthi of Tarsh are not horribly oppressed,
they are they waiting eagerly for rebellion. This, to me, is a far more
convincing line of argument than a vague sense of historical inevitability.
No, there is no intrinsic hatred between the Lunar and Orlanthi
way. Which doesn't mean that Sartarites don't hate Lunars (they invaded in
living memory, wartime memories are still fresh, etc.), and it also doesn't
mean that Sartarite Orlanthi might not feel that Lunar and Orlanthi hatred
is inevitable. After all, the Sartarite Orlanthi don't know much about the
Lunar way, except it involves governers, taxes, and legions (and the
occasional poor house), and they also have no shortage of Orlanthi
propagandists argueing vociferously against a lasting peace.
Everything else about Stephen message sounds fairly on the money -
but there is no need to resort to explanations of inevitable historical
hostility, plain old politics would supply the hatred even if their
religions where very similar.
>Orlanth is by his very nature
>rebellious,
I am still waiting for an explanation of how a god of chieftains,
who supplies spells designed to strengthen their hold, is intrinsically
'rebellious'. Orlanth highly loyalty and the rule of law. He just believes
that the way to maintain this is by beating up on the unjust. (NB the
Orlanthi admit that killing the Emperor was a mistake, don't they?).
>However, come the Hero wars and
>Orlanthi victories, the Orlanthi folk of Tarsh etc. will remember their proud
>traditions and rise against their masters.
I think its more along the lines of come the Hero Wars, Lunar
mishandling of the political situation creates rifts in the Tarsh body
politic that are skilfully exploited by the master political manipulator
Argrath. Argrath goes to the aid of the Fazzurites - hardly the steadfast
holders of Orlanthi tradition! Fazzur is a former military governer and a
Yanafali! Though I'm sure Argrath does everything he can to justify himself
by appealing to Orlanthi traditional values.
(PS once again, I am pre-empted - this time by Peter M, who said
most of this better, as I discovered only after already writing this. I
fear the long time digests denizens are becoming a chorus of orthodoxy).
Cheers
David
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