From: Peter Metcalfe (phm30@student.canterbury.ac.nz)
Date: Thu 03 Jul 1997 - 15:06:26 EEST
David Cake:
===========
> I find myself unable to decide whether I am outraged at the
>audacity of Peter to resort to (as he so often does) not only ignoring
>myths he doesn't like,
I didn't ignore it, I just said it was true only for a limited area.
>but insisting that everyone else does so as well, or
Did I?
>filled with laughter at the mention of the Lie spell involved, or simply
>stunned at the double audacity of brazenly admitting it all.
I'm suprised that you would be stunned having seen me in action for
nigh on three years now.
>>C'mon! [Arkat] a secret society, not an august society of fulltime
>>sorcerers.
> As I mentioned before in my last message on Arkati, I think you are
>deciding that the Arkati (thats all Arkati, everywhere, it seems) are a
>secret society, the uz equivalent of the troll Illuminati (the Halikiv
>Obscuranti?), ignoring the Troll Gods writeup because it doesn't agree with
>you, and then sounding abusing me for having the temerity to take it in any
>way seriously.
Where in the cult description does it say that the Arkati are required
to be fulltimers? You have been instinctively assuming that all Arkati
cultists are either apprentice rank or higher *and* have to work fulltime
at maintaining their positions. That is a model of learning sorcery
found in the RQIII roolz which is somewhat based on human medieval
guildlife. The relevance of this model to the Uz is highly doubtful and
that is what I have been criticizing you for.
I don't recall 'sounding abusing' you but you're welcome to
some (offline naturally) if you want.
>After all, you are a much more authoritative source than any
>mere published rules!
Why thank you. I acquire it from the same source as Greg. By
deciding in my mind's eye what Glorantha is like and exploring
it from there. *Not* by looking at the roolz and say this must
be the way things are.
>>>far away from cult centres of power, though, most Arkati are full
>>>timers. [...] In Dagori Inkarth, uz join the cult because they want
>>>to become sorcerers (and they are accepted because the sorcerers
>>>want apprentices).
>>You're arguing from the roolz again.
> I furthermore find the rhetorical tactic whereby any reference to
>allocation of time spent in activity by you is reasonable, but by me
>constitutes an argument from 'the roolz', to be tiresome. Get a grip.
Mainly because I argue from a position of what the life of the
average Uz Arkati may be like (ie the Uz who has a night job and
practices sorcery in his downtime) whereas you seem to be relying
on the RQIII roolz to argue that it must be fulltime and there is
no alternative whatsoever. The difference to me seems to be
obvious and not a case of irregular verbs. Thus I stand by my
remarks.
>>How are the Uz sorcerers
>>going to get their daily food trollkin if they work full time at
>>their sorcery?
> In return for sorcerous services? As obscure but revered religious
>functionaries? Whatever.
Who is going to pay for them? Think! If we adopt the line that
they can survive fulltime as sorcerers, then we might as well
populate glorantha with the likes of the infamous town of Jotenheim
which boasts a sword factory, a martial arts training centre, an
alchemist's store, a drug store, a slave market, a clothing store
and an armour factory for a population of only 700 people!
What can they do produce that the local priestesses and shamans
can't? Is it plausible that other Uz can pay them so much that
they can study fulltime at their craft? What if a Mother asks
him to do some sorcery? Does he charge her (and get beaten up
for his presumption) or does he do it as a service that every uz
performs to their local mother? The Uz do not normally live in
a society in which a sorcerer can make a full time living for
services.
> Why should an Uz sorcerer (with religious status) be intrinsically
>less able to sustain themselves than any other?
Religious status, smeligious status. Most religious positions
are not full time jobs in any society nor are they profitable.
You seem to be saying that an Uz can merely advertise himself
as a sorcerer and the customers will start coming in. Or that
because a Uz Arkati knows several spells that are useful only
to the aims of the cult and/or his religious development, that
his kin will support him fulltime.
- --Peter Metcalfe
------------------------------
End of The Glorantha Digest V5 #10
**********************************
To unsubscribe from the Glorantha Digest, send an "unsubscribe"
command to glorantha-digest-request@chaosium.com. Glorantha is a
Trademark of Chaosium Inc. With the exception of previously
copyrighted material, unless specified otherwise all text in this
digest is copyright by the author or authors, with rights granted to
copy for personal use, to excerpt in reviews and replies, and to
archive unchanged for electronic retrieval.
WWW at http://rider.wharton.upenn.edu/~loren/rolegame.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.7 : Fri 13 Jun 2003 - 17:58:38 EEST