Gods Wall, Rules, Wild Hunt, Flintnail

From: Stephen Martin (ilium@juno.com)
Date: Sat 03 Jan 1998 - 22:46:45 EET

Andrew Behan asks about Kenstrata and Ulkamoon:
>Finally is there any connection between Ulkamoon and Kenestrata? Their
>icon on the God Wall is identical and they are both referred to as the
>god of the club.

When talking about the description of the Gods Wall in GRoY, one must
keep in mind that what is written there is not FACT, but opinion,
presumably the opinions of Plentonius.

Thus, it is unlikely that Ulkamoon is the deity at II-24. This is most
likely the god Deseeti, mentioned elsewhere in GRoY. Note that this

figure is NOT looking away from Yelm, nor is that a club being held up in
front of him -- it is his erect Penis.

There are similar misidentifications in GRoY -- for example, the figure
at III-17 is not Sagittus, but rather the deity Brightface, whose myths
are detailed in Entekosiad.

I don't recall any mention of Orogeria in GRoY or even the Fortunate
Succession. The reference is most likely to The Dara Happan Emperor Book,
FS's precursor, which had some info on the lives of the Red Goddess. If
you have Entekosiad, you probably have this info.

Jane Williams
>Not as such, nor can I. But I do notice that no-one ever seems to be
>described in any scenario pack has having any kind of congenital
>Never. Not even once. Old injuries, yes, but no-one is, for instance,
>short-sighted. The aging rules do not include loss of perception
>abilities (except indirectly). Thus, I think that such problems either
>occur far less than in the RW, or are more immediately lethal. Or, the
>authors were writing happy rose-tinted fiction: but let's not fall back
>on that solution unless we have to :)

Actually, I think we have to rely upon that explanation, to some extent:
in RQ2, Resurrection caused losses of skills and spells. In RQ3, this was
"simplified" to cause loss of characteristics.

Thus, all of a sudden a person being resurrected after 3 days does not
lose skill points? I would think no sudden magical change occurred in
Glorantha: the rules which _approximate_ Glorantha changed.

Personally, I think people age in Glorantha pretty much the same as they
do in the RW, with all of the same infirmities: loss of strength and
speed, loss of faculties, loss of skills, and loss of perceptions.

Secondly, although few if any "handicapped" NPC's have appeared, there
are a couple of specific references in print to the presence of such
birth defects. the Pamaltela "What the Priests Say" in Gods of Glorantha
mentions albinos. And the description of the Celestial Court god Ratslaf
in the Prosopaedia of GoG specifically mentions "minor deformities [and]
blemishes": wandering eyes, warts, stammering, buck teeth, mottled skin,

>Given that Glorantha is an extremely magical and mythical place, the
>first place I look for a reason for differences from the RW is in magic
>and ritual.

But don't ignore the fact that much of Glorantha has been presented to us
through rules, and those parts cannot be taken solely at face value.

>Would a seriously handicapped child be seen as being chaos-tainted?
Given >that, in Glorantha, disease IS caused by chaos, would this
perception be

Actually, some cultures view a connection between disease and chaos, some
don't. I don't think even all Orlanthi and Ernaldans view disease as
specifically caused by chaos.

>Healers can re-attach limbs and bring people back from the dead: given
>the number of healing spells Ernalda has, and her intense interest in
>childbirth, don't you think she might have a solution to quite a lot of
>this stuff?
Following up on what Sandy said in #315, both of these acts restore the
person back to their original, undamaged form. Ever wonder why Chalana
Arroy, Miss Resurrection, is the owner of the Harmony Rune, not the Life
Rune? Resurrection has _nothing_ to do with "Life" per se -- it is a
healing of the spirit and body to life.

"Life" sees no need to heal -- why waste energy healing something which
is wounded, when you can just grow another?

And on the Wild Hunt:
>Quite how this fits into Glorantha I'm not sure. It sounds most like a
>bunch of Gargarthi to me, but it should be a hunter deity really.

Well, Gagarth IS a Hunter, he is just a hunter of soules, not a hunter of
game. Note also that Gagarth is a shared deity of the Praxians, and he
has a very definite association with whirlvishes. I would imagine that
the Orlanthi Wild Hunt, especially in Dragon Pass, would have a lot of
Praxian characteristics -- whirlwinds, dust devils, blasting sand,
howling spirit wolves, etc. Maybe even the occasional whirlvish.

Eric Nolander
>Has anyone tried converting the RQ2 Flintnail cult to RQ3?

>Could the cult structure be kept as it is, do you think? Also, would all

>spells have to be converted to sorcery spells? Maybe, since it seems to
>be rather an Openhandism sort of cult, it could be treated as more of a
>"regular" cult than a sorcery "school". What do you think?

I made a start for Drastic: Prax, then abandoned it when it became very
obvious there would not be room. I agree with Peter Metcalfe that the
cult structure should be converted to a guild structure. However, I would
make the apprentices lay members, the initiates journeymen, and have the
rune levels be the Masters, in addition to the guild leadership.

I would retain the Divine Magic, but would also add some alchemy stuff in
as well. Because ...

Peter Metcalfe>If the mostali use spirit magic then they are apostate.
>However since Flintnail was a rock mostali

Actually, all indications have Flintnail being the same as Isidilian the
Wise, the famous Dwarf of Dwarf Run, who is a Quicksilver Mostali. And
yes, I know, how could the Pavis dwarfs worship a god who is still alive
as an Ancestral Mostali? Well, first of all, people _can_ create gods,
and gods _can_ "split." But besides, most of them are dwarfs -- how much
can they ever truly understand about _religion_?

>(and true mostali cannot by definition be
>apostate IMO), then the cult must be sorcery-using.

Although true Mostali by definition cannot be apostate, that doesn't mean
that a cult founded by a half-human son could not be apostate -- I see no
reason to convert the Flintnail cult to sorcery, and lots of reasons not
to -- they are more fun as parodies of humans, but better at many things
than humans themselves. Their spells would be difficult to convert to
sorcery spells, but work fine as Divine spells. The very
closely-connected Pavis cult does not use sorcery, and I would think that
if the Flintnail cultists did, the Pavis cultists would as well, since

Pavis was a sorcery-using EWFer, by all accounts.

>I don't think Flintnail would give Divine Intervention. IMO the
>cult is devoid of any spiritual element and most human cultists
>look to Orlanth and Ernalda for afterlife etc.

I agree that the cult should not provide Divine Intervention, nor should
they have both priests and lords -- both of these are rules constructs,
IMO. But the cult must have some sense of an afterlife, since by
definition all dwarfs who enter it know _beyond a doubt_ that they are
going to die someday. None of the dwarfs in Pavis would worship Flintnail

if he could not offer them some hope of a continued existence, IMO.

Peter Metcalfe asks:
>BTW do the Flanchi have the same caste system? [as the Elamle]

I don't think so -- at least one version of the Maslo article says that
there are a number of specific subgroups on the Onalaks and Elamle
peninsulas, then goes on to say that the Elmale (in particular) are known
for their four-tiered caste system.

To chime in my vote, I believe this four-tiered caste system must have
been originated or at least influenced by the God Learners who fled into
or through this land. But, I agree that it should bear little resemblance
to the Malkioni versions already known, and the lack of any Malkioni
religious traits should keep anyone from claiming the Masloi as a
Malkioni sect or heresy.

Stephen Martin
- -----------------------------------------------
The Book of Drastic Resolutions


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