Six Legged Empire

From: David Cake (davidc@cyllene.uwa.edu.au)
Date: Fri 27 Feb 1998 - 10:46:06 EET


Peter Metcalfe and I discussing the Six Legged Empire and related things
>> I think that the leadership of the Six Legged were mostly from
>>Fonrit and nearby, perhaps connected to the Sorcerers of Kalabar.
>
>Depends on what you mean by Fonrit.

        I hadn't got around to defining it more specifically than that. I
know the God Learners were active in Fonrit (one of their fleets was sunk
there), and it certainly sounds right to me that the Fonritians would be
keen on an expansionist campaign to capture wealth from Jolar. What little
we know of the Six Legged Empire culture does not sound at all incompatible
with Fonritian culture (though very different to the culture of Jolar).

>>They probably conquered Laskal
>>as well. Thats not the only possibility, but its my favoured option of the
>>moment.
>
>I strongly doubt this. Much about Kothar and Tarien is only assumed
>from details about Jolar. If the Six-Legged Empire didn't expand
>into those regions then why would they conquer Laskal which is far
>less attractive (ie covered with light jungle and hills)?

        Upon looking at the map again I agree with you - I don't think they
ever conquered Laskal - Jungle (plus yellow elves) would make their tactics
disastrous. I do think that there were raids into the Laskal jungle to
capture rumoured fabulous treasures (think H. Rider Haggard and Kipling),
and very likely slaves, but I don't think the Six Legged Empire would ever
have been able to hold much of it.

>IMO the Six Leggers and/or the Goanese claimed control over Laskal.
>However this control was largely illusory as the terrain prevented
>effective government.

        Exactly.

[I said 'the Doraddi think they are progressing away from the trappings of
civilisation, and were actually more outwardly civilised before Hon
Hoolbiktu']

>I take completely the opposite view and posit John Hughes 'Left Footpath'
>tribes as the original inhabitants of Jolar.

        The Doraddi views on the progress of civilisation originate with
Sandy, and I like them too, more than I like the Left Footpath stuff, so
I'm sticking with it for now, at least as representing recent history.
Certainly, I think the Doraddi were more civilised in the Second Age, and
are deliberately less so in the Third (and claim to be much happier for
it), and this change is a result of Hon Hoolbiktu.
        Whether this really represents a truthful view of evolution from
even earlier Doraddi culture, though, I'm not sure. Though it does seem
rather doubtful that (as some Doraddi now claim) they used to have big
cities but they are all gone now. But I do know that there are a host of
other things I'm unsure of about First age and earlier Pamaltela, such as
where the Artmali empire and the Baba Ulodr worshipping Agimori and other
Old Gods fit in, and so I wouldn't want to speculate too much at the
moment. I'm thinking about these issues a lot at the moment, but I'm no
closer to an answer.
        Sandy and I currently agree that the Left Footpath culture is found
in the poorer ground of the Tarien, but pretty much gone in Jolar/Kothar.
John, if you are out there, how do you feel about that? I would tend to
feel that the Left Footpath is descended from Tarien Dawn Age culture and
has been increasingly 'Pamaltised' since then.

>Since the Dawn, the Ia
>Rawthi should be expanding into the plains of Jolar. Since they haven't,
>I assume their cereals don't grow too well in Jolar.

        Jolar in TOTRM #8 is specifically said to have no grass style
plants, having clover instead. I would assume there is a good reason for
it.

>Thus IMO the Six-Leggers took over the oases by force and represented
>a radical cultural change.

        Definately. The Six Leggeds took over by taking the oases, building
permanent forts at them, and then setting up roads between them. This is in
stark contrast to the Doraddi way of doing things, where the oases are
occupied by old people from a variety of tribes. Not to mention the Doraddi

weren't big on organised conflict, so the Six Legged troops where a bit of
a shock.

>>And the idea of Pamalt as the southern Earth King, Generts counterpart, is
>>also something I don't think is original to the Pamaltelan religion, along
>>with the attempt to turn his pantheon into an earth pantheon.
>
>Considering that Pamalt is a natural chieftain figure, it gets very
>hard to imagine him as not being the earth king.

        He is the chieftain over the earth gods, and all the earth gods and
spirits obey him. But his relationship to the earth is very different to
Generts. Genert was always an earth god, Pamalt as far as I can tell
married into the Earth tribe (Faranar was an earth goddess), and his

earliest recorded deeds are as a firebringer. Most of his early deeds
(before Vovisibor) he performs with the cooperation of another, while
Genert was always powerful himself. Generts connection to the land is
direct, while Pamalt mostly maintains his control by the cooperation of
other gods. Genert is exclusively an Earth god, Pamalt is a fire bringer
(both the Promethean role, and uses fire as a weapon against Vovisibor and
the Uz). Genert is fertility, Pamalt is stability.
        I think there is probably a myth where Pamalt actually gains his
earth powers, rather than being a great earth being by nature.

        Which is not to say that considering him as an earth king is in
anyway wrong. Its just that saying 'the Pamalt pantheon is an earth
pantheon, and Pamalt is the Southern Genert', which I believe was pretty
much the God Learner view (though not necessarily the Six Leggeds) is very
simplistic. Its another repeat of the classic God Learner 'here are two
deities that occupy similar roles, they are obviously really much the
same'.

        Cheers

                David

Even if Jmije was your enemy, you would still say he was a fast runner.
 - Doraddi Proverb

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