Argrath and horse issues

From: Bob Stancliff (
Date: Tue 21 Mar 2000 - 23:27:54 EET

> Argrath is how the Dragon Pass Orlanthi pronounce
> "Arkat" and as of 1621, they do think of the word
> as meaning liberator.
>- --Peter Metcalfe
        Interesting Peter, but is this a published source or anecdotal?
It looks
like we're going to have some follow-up on this.


> Except there are at least two other Argraths around
> at the time, and in one of those cases (Bad Dream
> Enostar, aka Argrath of Pavis) we know its an alias
> or title. Either they are all known as Argrath for
> a reason, or there is a very extreme coincidence.
> Cheers David
        It clearly depends on how you read King of Sartar. I believe that there
is only one Argrath and several mixed up legends. I know several people
disagree with that statement.
        As I read it: Argrath was hiding in Pavis under multiple disguises. As a
tavern minstrel, he went by the name Enostar(sp?), and as a sword master
at the Humakt temple, he went under the name Garrath Sharpsword (notice
the anagram: gARrath = ARgrath). When he was wandering with the Bison
riders as a ground man, he founded the Brotherhood of the White Bull under
his real name of Argrath. All of these people were known for disappearing
for weeks at a time and no one connected the identities.


> "Taxation is theft !" Murray N. Rothbard
> (Brooklyn 1926- Manhattan 1995)
        Isn't that the truth and, like the Vendraf, we tend to tolerate it! We
are afraid to be called callous or heartless because we think that the
majority of deadbeats the money is being spent on should get off their
duffs and get real jobs to doubly reduce the tax burden!


> In my own private Glorantha, "Arkat" became the word
> for "liberator" in the theyalean language of the west
> Orlanthi (ralians), whereas in Maniria & Peloria it
> transformed itself into "argrath". So that this wily
> Garrath Swordsharp guy very astutely saw the word-play
> he could do with his name & exploited it to the max !
> Christoph Kohring
        I have asked Peter for his source, do you have one? I can understand you
choosing this option, but why did the spelling/pronunciation change? I
guess 600+ years is long enough...


>From: Andreas Mueller <>
>Subject: Garhound - Horses in Prax
> I agree that Yelmalions would like to have horses
> again. On the other hand, I made it a point in my
> campaign, that a sensible traveller through Prax
> _or_ the Wastes wouldn't ride on horses.
        That is, not in groups of less than 8 to 12, obviously armed and alert.
Riding alone on a horse in the Wastes or southern Prax is suicidal and
will certainly get the horse killed.

> At Pimpers Block there's, apart from trading slaves,
> a whole economy thriving on travellers to and from
> Prax exchanging Zebras with Horses
        In your game. The idea is reasonable for anyone, but with enough care,
horses can survive a long time in this region.

> I can't recall where I've read that horses weren't
> thriving in Prax climate and that this was also a
> major reason for Sun County to abandon horse-farming.
        There is nothing wrong with the climate, unless you are refering to the
climate of hostility held by nomads towards horses.
        When the Yelmalians first came they had many horses but, during their
isolated period, repeated nomad raids killed all of the herds. This was
the condition at least until the founding of New Pavis when the isolation
was broken and a large number of Orlanthi farmers migrated from Sartar
with their herds of cattle sheep and horses.
        This is a rather recent event, so while there are many horses now, they
could easily be killed off at some future time. It is not likely to
happen during the Lunar occupation, but certainly later.

> I'm aware that this stands in contrast to the fact
> of Pol Joni in Prax _and_ the Wastes
        I tend to doubt that Pol Joni live in the Wastes. The tribe congregates
in the Good Place on the border of Sartar and dominate the accesses to the
foothills. They probably have more Sartarite than nomad members and they
adopt a mixture of cultural elements from both sources. Their predominate
religion is Orlanthi though I would expect a larger than normal nomad
Storm Bull following.

> Then two other things striked me:
> 1. Hasn't been Yelm the first husband of Ernalda and
> Yelmalio one of their sons?
        By Orlanthi myth this should technically be true. It is likely that
Yelmalio stands in for his father in these mythic recreations. If we
analyzed every module this carefully before they got published, the one or
two that finally got published would be much higher quality, but the rest
would be shredded in the review room and never see print.

> 2. If it's bad luck, to get somebody out of the contest
> (the homicide subplot asks the players to protect Jarst
> Daro from that wonderful Babeester Gor Runemistress
        That's not quite what it says...

> because getting him out of the contest (probably by
> severe injuries ;-) would result in a blight), why
> should Sor-Eel bother about making the wrong person

> win?
        If he had died in the joust, that would have been OK, but no one knew he
was an ogre then. If he is killed just because he is an Ogre, that would
violate the divine competition and offend the gods... he has to be beaten.
        Sor-Eel wants a Lunar sympathizer to win so that he can subvert Garhound
politics. If you run a new Garhound each year this subplot gets very old.
Sor-Eel doesn't care if the harvests are worse than normal... his men are
better trained and equiped, let the peasants starve.
        The gods want to see a sterling representative win that they can favor,
otherwise, one is just about as good as another as long as they try to do

IMO, Stancliff


This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.7 : Fri 13 Jun 2003 - 21:12:18 EEST