Henotheism'n'stuff.

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From: alex@dcs.gla.ac.uk
Date: Wed 25 May 1994 - 20:51:32 EEST

Joerg quotes me:
> > I suspect that the Ralian Henotheistic Church doesn't use the term saint
> > for "actual" deities, but that other Malkioni (heretical) cults, who
> > consider the manifest deities less important, do.

I quote Joerg:
> First of all, I believe that there are a lot of henotheist churches,
> or at least sects (subcults), in Ralios. Some are Stygian, some are
> Cthonic, some are Aeolian, and some are Solar. A lot of these have animal
> saints replacing the old Hsunchen deities, IMO.

Indeed, there are many henotheist churches, but there is one (apparently) _called_ "the Henotheistic Church". Whether it's in any way a unitary religion I have no idea. But it seems natural to me to suppose that, generally speaking, each sect or religion uses the term "saint" to indicate whether it considers an entity is a "lesser" one, comparable to the mortal saints of orthodox Malkionism, or a "greater" one, mentionable in the same breath as "real" gods, like the IG. (Just not "I".) I'm not enamored of the idea of all sects using the term for everyone in sight, regardless about their beliefs about them.

> Then I believe that if not in Ralios, where else would you find all
> degrees from casual mentioning of theist gods in Malkioni creed to
> "we worship many gods: [...], oh yes, and then there's the Invisible
> God, and his high priest Malkion."

In Ralios, indeed. Though the Carmanians may have invented a flavour all of their own. (Or not.)

> > Using the same term for obscure heroes
> > and major deities doesn't really inspire confidence in claims that this
> > _isn't_ a questioning of the importance of the latter, though.

> Obscure heroes like Arkat and major deities like Minlister? Come on.

Come on, indeed. Arkat isn't an obscure hero, and Minlister isn't a deity I've heard of. Could you please disagree with the point I was making, not the straw man I wasn't? If you use one set of terminology for one group of gods (the Aeolian Trinity) and another for a second group, (the Aeolian saints), then you're implying that each is different from the other group, and similar to members of the same group. That is, Issaries and <local obscure hero> are "just" saints, while Orlanth and the Invisible God are "proper members of the trinity". I don't say this structure isn't possible, or even unlikely, generally speaking, but where it does occur, it's likely to be regarded with suspicion by "orthodox" worshippers of, say, Issaries.

If you insist on picking holes in your own divine/mortal distinction, then substitute "considered important" and "considered not so important".

> > Actually, I have very few objections to the Aeolian Church, apart from where
> > you've put it.

> I didn't put it there.

<sigh> I can't help thinking this isn't a response to what I said, but let me rephrase more carefully: "I have very few objections to a religion existing in Glorantha with a theology and structure like that you propose for the Aeolian Church, but I do not think that such a church would be widely worshipped in Heortland."

> > Bit of a fine distinction, then. At any rate, what I was suggesting was
> > that if a god receives active, fairly "traditional" worship in an area,
> > having a bunch of Wizards swan along and downrate him to Saint Thingy
> > isn't likely to cause them to whoop for joy.

> Otkorion has both the seat of the Archbishop of the Henotheist Church
> and a Great Temple to Orlanth. Where is this religious war you seem to
> ask for in Hendrikland there in Ralios?

I said nothing about a religious war (between who?); clearly my occassional attempts at levity via stake-sharpening remarks has either fallen rather flat, or is being actively misconstrued.

> I see peaceful and fruitful
> coexistence, not religious rivalry, between the Henotheists and the
> theists.

I've no idea, off the top of my head, what political situation pertains in Otkorion, but I certainly don't think "conversative" Orlanthi, and full-blown henotheists (of the "St. Orlanth" persuasion, as it were) consider themselves co-religionists. (Or should that be "co-cultists"?) Similarities of religious belief can be cause for either buddy-buddy ecumenicalism, or for outright hostility.

Alex.

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