From: Nick Brooke (100270.337@CompuServe.COM)
Date: Thu 23 Jun 1994 - 23:30:55 EEST
> [Hmmm, nice theory, perhaps I should publish]
about the Lunar Empire and Sartar. Well, I believed it... <g>
> I think modern Loskalm is a product of the Ban, and of King Siglat's
> work. His inhuman intelligence - and the Syndics Ban - allowed this
> system to function. Now both Siglat and the Ban are gone, the system
> is starting to fail, and will either collapse or attempt military
> conquest to convert the rest of Fronela.
I also agree 100% with this analysis: exactly what I think is happening.
> Greg seems to have cultures whom he doesn't like, and to whom he gives
> attitudes he finds reprehensible. The Western attitude to women seems
> to be one of them.
> Storm might always be talked of as low status, Moon and Sun always as
> high status.
One feature of some Gloranthan products that I'm tempted to assign to New
Pelorian is the so-called "Air Rune". Come off it, guys: it's the STORM @
Rune! "Air" is a sort of empty wimpy nothingness, like that slut Molanni.
"Storm" is a proper, *manly* Element that I'd be proud to run & shout for.
So, IMHO, "Air" is the New Pelorian word for "Storm".
Similarly, the alleged misprints in "Cults of Terror" - with Disorder Runes
replacing Chaos Runes everywhere - are another subtle attempt to influence
> Who will be stuck with Night? Presumably the poor casteless, since
> Night can't be that positive an epithet in a solar-dominated land.
I said:
>> I suspect that the "release from the cycle of reincarnation" is an
>> aspect of Kralori Mysticism imported to Teshnos, not local.
Nils:
> I don't think so. Reincarnation is a part of solar thinking. I don't
> remember the reference...
(RQ Companion Jonstown Compendium, plus sundry mentions on this list)
> I see reincarnation as a typical Teshnan view, while the Kralorelans,
> who follow the dead dragon emperor away from this world forever are not
> subject to the cycle.
> I doubt whether the Romans would have had as much 'fun' with Alexander
> the Great...
Eh? Romans (and Greeks) were happy to dispute the leadership aspects of this in antiquity, but as with yesterday's "Heroic Mob" blooper, perhaps you've forgotten that when the Roman legions came up against Macedonian phalanxes they defeated them handily.
> When it says "Orlanth did this, Orlanth thought that"; try "the cult of
> Orlanth did this, the cult of Orlanth thought that". Before you know it,
> the battle between the gods becomes a clash of cultures.
This method works very nicely for me. Cf. Greg Stafford's letter re: the Broken Earth cults in Tales #7 for more of the same.
>> What makes you think a Troll could become a Yelmalian simply by >> performing normal initiation rituals?
> Well, she could possibly get the magic attributed to Yelmalio by this
> means (is this what you mean by "becoming a Yelmalian"?).
Easier to use the standard troll rituals for obtaining Yelmalion powers... just ask Amastan, down in your local Zorak Zoran caverns.
> Is there a source (or could someone tell me) what are all the known
> Runes?
No published source contains all of them. If you have the "Introduction to Glorantha" book from the old "Deluxe RuneQuest" box (or, I'd imagine, the equivalent chapter in the new book), you'll be missing just a few. I hope I'm covering them all below:
The funny one Godunya has is usually called Dragon.
The unusual one Pamalt has is called Power, or Pamalt.
The odd one for Gorgorma is the Shadow rune, an odd form of Darkness. Similarly, Valind has the Cold rune, which is another Darkness variant.
That peculiar one on Krarsht is the Hunger rune, often called Undead.
Lodril has Heat and Yelmalio Light, both being subsets of Fire/Sky.
Asrelia has Luck, and Ty Kora Tek Fate.
Any I've missed? If you don't have the sources I mention, I could run along one of those Runic page headers in a private mailshot to try and sort them out for you...
> One thing I'd like to see in Gloranthan publications: Female, Lunar
> military officers ... the everyday army seems dominated by men.
Agreed. But the Army and the Empire are the masculine aspect of the Red Moon; the Priesthood and the Lunar Way are its more important, feminine manifestation. As important as "Priestess" being the default title for a Rune Priest of the Seven Mothers, is that "Lord" is the default for Rune Lords and Ladies alike. IMHO. So the everyday army is dominated by men.
> I claim to have never specifically named anyone on the list as a Scholar.
Whyever not? You're the man who claimed to have identified the breed. And reticence is hardly your forte.
> They [Sumerians, not Scholars] also were similar to us at a much MORE
> profound level. Maybe the problem is just that I am talking about a
> level that is more deeply rooted in the human condition...maybe even
> instinctual.
Maybe even meaningless. See below for more. In a different context, you asked:
> Then we both think differently. How shall we prove it? <g>
Well, let's see. I'll post a quotation supporting my beliefs, then you can send us one that supports yours. If you can find any. My opening shot comes from a fine book called "Reality Isn't What It Used To Be," for which I'm greatly indebted to your friend and mine, that constructive clansman Mr. Peter Michaels:
: The anthropologists probably deserve much of the credit -- or the blame : -- for bringing out into clear view the remarkable range of realities : that exist in a world that, one would have thought, had but a single : reality. The early anthropologists were the true pioneers of the : twentieth century, going out in search of culture shock, exposing : themselves to it in the same valiantly careless way scientists might : expose themselves to disease. They invented "participant observation," : a brilliant addition to the human mind's repertoire of ways to make : itself uncomfortable. It meant living as closely as possible to the way : people of primitive cultures lived. : The anthropologists squatted in the dust of African villages, hunted : and feasted on whale blubber with Eskimos, danced in the magical rites : of Trobriand Islanders. And they returned with information -- not only : anecdotes and analyses, but art and sculpture and clothing and tools. : Nothing had ever before matched the accumulation of information about : different societies that filled the libraries and the museums in Europe : and America in the decades after World War I. : People contemplated this and felt something more serious than a mild : case of culture shock. Those who really took it in, in all its awesome : variety, experienced a deep psychological disturbance that has sometimes : been described as the "vertigo of relativity." They saw overwhelming : evidence that different peoples had constructed entirely different : systems of value and belief, knowledge and myth. Inevitably, those who : absorbed this material revised not only their ideas about exotic peoples, : but also their ideas about themselves.
Back to Devin:
> Gee, somewhow I see comparing how Glorantha DIFFERS from Ancient Earth
> as a bit different than saying Glorantha IS just like Earth.
Especially if you cunningly conceal your expert knowledge of Ancient Earth behind a convincing facade of superficiality and ignorance.
Saying "Glorantha IS just like Earth" -- does anyone really do this?
Saying it differs: fine, we all agree. It's when you get onto the psycho- logical and religious specifics of *how* Glorantha differs from Earth that our collective gorges rise. Explain if you will how the Aztecs, Samurai, Christian Martyrs, Jews at Masada, Nazis, and today's terrorists in the Middle East, Rwanda and Bosnia echo your sensibilities. These are, after all, people "profoundly similar" at "an instinctual level" to you and your so-called So Cal 'rational' attitudes. <g>
Please look at this world, before telling me everyone in it is reasonable. For a self-proclaimed expert on World War 2 to assume this is so, is odd.
Yours, in deep psychological disturbance,
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