From: Alex Ferguson (alex@dcs.gla.ac.uk)
Date: Fri 19 Aug 1994 - 09:59:52 EEST
Roderick Robertson and I replying to various things, mainly each other:
> >We were talking about (circa) Am. Civil War era at this point. I was
> >specifically questioning whether such troops were as dense as pre-gunpowder
> >units.
> Yes, the close-order formations of
> ACW troops, British Colonials, etc. was shoulder to shoulder.
> >Let's not forget missile-affecting spells.
> >[...]Gross spells on volleys of arrows would act as a disincentive to
> >remaining in close order.
> I'd say that the magical defenses of the target unit will
> probably negate the magical bonus of the attacking missile unit.
Well, partly, assuming that the _particular_ attacked unit even has 'em, that it has the appropriate defensive spell, that it collectively "decides" to cast it at the right moment, and successfully coordinates casting it in time. It's considerably too simple just to say that "equal" magic on either side negates each other.
> [...] and my defensive spell lasts for 5 minutes.
Or two, depending on the value of <n>. At any rate, not a huge length of time if the battle lasts all day. And as you later say:
> Do we cast Protection now to protect against a possible arrow
> barrage, or save the points for a volley of Disruption in case they
> charge?
The tactics of "negating" your opponent's magic is itself non-trivial.
> My point is that *only* when one side has a
> magical advantage will tactics need to be revised.
It'd be about the one and only military innovation for which this were true, then.
> As far as not having close-order troops, most spells do not have to
> be rolled to target.
Let me rererereinterate that I'm not saying, nor have I ever said, that Glorantha doesn't have close order troops. I'll happily stipulate that Lunar/Dara Happan troops use such formations, if it makes anyone any happier. (Though I suspect they might _also_ use a (more) open formation, perhaps in the way Roman maniples did, for Revoltin' Developments like giants throwing rocks at 'em, or the Bat Hunger table causing it to go filter-feeding.)
> >> Sunspear strikes in a 1-meter circle (basically one man),
> >> Thunderbolt and Sever Spirit hit one target.
> >On the other hand, what do mass-castings of, say, Sunspear by circles of
> >twenty magicians simultaneously do? <extrapolate, extrapolate>
> Unless they have some ability (outside of current game rules) to
> stack or amplify the spells, you get 20 1-meter circles to place where
> you want.
Yeah, well, that's what I specifically hypothesised, nay, asserted. The RQ rules aren't, in my view, the be-all-and-end-all of Gloranthan simulation, especially when extrapolating to a different scale (literally or figuratively), and where there are other sources which contra-indicate. For example, I tend to imagine that the Sun Burn wasn't carried out by someone going round Sun Spearing every tree in the forest individually from 100 paces away. (Mutatis mutandis, "Moon Burn", at least if MOB's to be believed.)
> The Lunar Empire seems to have been the innovators
> in creating "Magical Units" who can do more than just do 20 single
> castings of one spell. Argrath has managed to create his own magical
> units, to match the abilities of the Lunars. But I wouldn't give
> pre-Lunar Dara Happans, or Praxians, or Holy Country troops the
> ability.
I don't think the (undoubted) innovations of the Magical Regiments included the fairly straightforward business of having a group of divine magicians cast their spells in concert.
> >> Unless there is some social reason not to (ransom?), officers
> >> would make wonderful targets for the few Rune-level spell-casters in a unit.
> >Otherwise things would get a bit silly, as the officer cadre of either side
> >is kiboshed in the first few seconds. Though non-com cynics might argue this
> >would be a Damn Good Thing...
> Then it's the turn of the non-coms... Anyone in any sort of
> distinctive outfit is a priority target. Heck, I'd target the Non-coms
> *first*, and let the officers try to lead their units without 'em.
I wasn't saying you'd not _want_ to eliminate enemy officers, I was doubting it'd be practicable. And if you say this sort of thing _is_ a likely target, it hardly makes things at all "pre-gunpowder"-like.
It's more of a feature of minature wargaming than any historical event I'm familiar with to Go For The Leader. (Other than in a Grand Strategic way, like Issus, say.) Not for nothing do various minatures rules have "No fair! Can't do that!" rules for doing so.
Though as a footnote, phalanxes don't particularly need an officer cadre, unless they want to do something vastly complex, like say, turn. Lunar phalanxes must be able to manage fairly well without "non-coms", too, if they put them somewhere silly like the front of the formation...
> Magic in Glorantha is just as much a Scissors-paper-rock type of thing as
> Guns-vrs-Armor races in Gunpowder era ships and tanks.
I'd agree entirely with this, which is why I disagree with the proposition that it's tactically neutral (or that it acts as leadership-material smart bombs).
Alex.
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.7 : Fri 10 Oct 2003 - 01:36:27 EEST