From: paul@phyast.pitt.edu
Date: Thu 17 Jun 1993 - 16:00:26 EEST
Paul here, replying to Oliver's message:
Training system: Looks good at first glance. Using bigger blocks
(days instead of hours) is a good idea. Will analyze later. Note it
does include skill modifier in training; as I've argued in the past,
the bright guy is going to be better at the end of the calculus course
as well as at the beginning.
>I kind of like Paul's idea of using Original POW to determine skill
>bonuses - the original POW roll determines whether you are fairly
>inobtrusive or have great presence, and would make a thief that
^^^^^
This was one of the things I had in mind. Thieves stay obscure, the
kid with magical talent who becomes a priest or shaman doesn't lose his
talent after getting Rune Spells or a fetch.
> I disagree
>with the idea of letting Original POW affect the likelihood of
>POW gain
I also think its unbalancing, however it does match a lot of genre fiction.
In some games we don't care about balance - look at Ars Magica. I think that
the suggested approach models what we read about Glorantha in the stories
better, e.g. Sheng Seleris was born with POW 21, species max, and kept
gaining power rapidly. He was very unbalanced (ask any Irrippi Ontori, they'll
give you a long lecture as to how unbalanced he was.) Note also that faster
POW gain for high POW characters is sort of built into the current system -
they become the priests, shamans, and sorcerors with far more opportunity for
gains.
But if we want to keep the idea of balance I don't mind. I was sort of
harking back to RQ 2 and the increased POW gain roll for priests, and said
"What if priests are _selected_ from those with high POW gain rolls rather
than getting a bonus?"
Anyway, I think that using original POW for modifiers (and not changing the
gain rolls) may be the best of both worlds:
1. Not unbalancing, but captures the genre idea of magically talented people.
2. Thieves will now stay stealthy. (In our campaign we used the rule that
Initiates of Thief and Hunter Gods used POW as a POSITIVE modifier for
Stealth, another solution to this one.)
3. NO MORE YOYO. Skill mods stay constant.
Category modifiers:
Agility:
I still think something mental goes into Agility, and from the people I
know who are good at these things, I think it's POW. My Aikido instructor
and my dressage (riding) instructor both had a tremendous personal force
which I have to describe as POW rather than charisma. Friends who climb
tell me that you are in a battle of wills with the mountain, this sounds
like POW. On the other hand, we are defining what stats mean here - you
can DEFINE DEX to mean 'the thing that determines physical skills'. Then
Oliver's proposed mod is OK.
Communication: I agree with Oliver, provided APP is the 'social stat' rather
than just looks. Walter Cronkite, Phyllis Diller, etc. have low looks but
a lot of charisma or presence.
Magic skills: I see an attempt at balancing mods here - if we are
SKILLS NOTE: Most Craft Skills should go under Manipulation. Have you seen
limited to two net primary modifiers I might drop the DEX and just have
INT + Original POW - 20. On the other hand, see Agility note above, perhaps
DEX includes a mental component. Do high DEX people think faster? Does
DEX include spatial intelligence? If so then Oliver's mod is OK.
an armorer at work? If so you'll agree that Dexterity should go in the
Armoring mod. Similarly with sewing, tailoring, etc. The idea of a
person with 18 INT but Str 4, Dex 3 being able to become a master blacksmith
is a bit absurd, isn't it? Move it over to manipulation - I want my smiths
burly.
>With respect to highly skilled fighters doing additional damage - to a
>certain extent specials and criticals handle that already - however, one
>of the best ideas I've seen suggested for this was by Brandon Bryslawski,
>who suggested that characters be allowed to subtract from their
>chance to hit in exchange for doing extra damage - something like
>+1 damage for every 20% subtracted from your skill - this would
We use something like this - you can swing for Truesword-type damage if you
drop your parry completely (winding up for a full swing). His system may
be better, haven't tried it.
Another rule would be to let fighters exchange skill for strike ranks,
>If you say that original pow is something like
this is similar to the one-shot rule I mentioned the other day.
___________
- Paul responds to Graeme on OJ's training system:
> One suggestion: rather than Time in Days = (skill/10) - (mod/10),
>why not Time in Days = (skill - mod)/10 to avoid problems caused
A good suggestion.
>"soul size" and later pow is "soul strength" it sounds a bit less
>grating.
I tend to think of Original POW as you magical potential, it stays with
you and you tend to wind up back at it. POW loss is sort of like
"long term soul fatigue" in this model, a debilitation you can recover
from. POW gain is a more-or-less temporary add on.
[Odd ideas:
Maybe a slight amount
of training could be allowed to Original POW, through meditation, retreat
to the wilderness, etc.
Or instead, retreats, etc. could give POW gains. (Perhaps only to recover
up to Original POW?) Valindi would retreat to the Glacier, Inorans to
snow capped mountains, etc. Communion with Nature or other culturally
appropriate stuff should be worth a gain roll per season or some such, this
is the classic way to regain lost verve.]
0,,
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